Tavern talk: What's a blue-chip player?

Awesome Idea. I really look forward to reading these.

Love hearing you on Bill's podcast. Hope you do the weekly show with him like last year.

Jets blue chippers:
Revis
Jenkins
Mangold
and Leon if viewed outside of position

Packers blue chippers:
Jennings
Kampman
Woodson

Potential blue chippers
Collins
Raji
Rodgers

Quality coaching and QB. Enough to make the playoffs.

If we're talking blue chip players, then surely some recognition has to go to Walter Jones of the Seahawks. The guy has been a dominant force on the line for a long time (although he may be on his last legs this season, tragically).

Loved hearing you on Simmon's Podcast last week and last year. Unlike most radio host and personalities, you know such much more about each team and the game in general than almost anyone I have come across. It's a real pleasure to read your columns everyday and listen to your podcast with Bill.

I have a hard time believing every team has a blue chip player. Some will obviously have more than one, but I don't think every team has a player that is a blue chipper. Wes Welker is a great player, but I would say Moss is a Blue Chip player and Welker isn't.

chargers:

LT
Rivers
Gates
McNeil (maybe)
Merriman
Jamal Williams
Cromartie (when merriman is healthy)
sproles (as a returner)

Chargers blue-chippers :

Offense :
Philip Rivers, Antonio Gates, LaDainian Tomlinson, Kris Dielman

Defense : Shawne Merriman, Jamal Williams

And you can make a case for Quentin Jammer who is vastly underrated in the NFL.

Vikings Blue Chippers

Adrian Peterson
Jared Allen
Kevin Williams
Steve Hutchinson

Maybe Winfield
Maybe E.J. Henderson

Browns:

Crennel
Savage
Couch
Kellen Winslow, Jr
Shaun Rogers
Brady Quinn

Patriots Blue Chippers:

The entire roster

Bills Blue Chips: Lee Evans and maybe marshawn lynch

Rams blue chips: NONE

My Broncs

Jay Cutler...oh...right...dammit.

"Patriots Blue Chippers: The entire roster"

I'd have to disagree. They have a few really good players, but it's these use of role players in the right situations that make the Patriots so consistently good. They are the highest standard of teamwork, self-sacrifice, and coaching.

Pats:

Brady
Moss
Welker
Mankins
Wilfork
Seymour
Warren
Mayo

I would count qb and coach blue chippers as 1.5 if not 2. Then count every other positional blue chip player as 1. With that rating i believe the pats have the highest rating. Where as the chargers have the most overall blue chippers.

Also blue chippers need to be proven (no rookies or non pro bowl type guys)

Colts blue chips

Offense:
Manning
Clark
Wayne

Defense:
Freeney
Sanders

I did not include Mathis or Saturday. Mathis gets favorable treatment due to Freeney. Saturday was close. And vinatieri is losing it and sucks on kickoffs.

I'd say the Pats list goes like this:

Offense:
Brady
Moss
Welker
Mankins

Defense:
Wilfork
Seymour
Mayo

I'd hope that by the end of the year we'll be able to add Pat Chung and Adalius Thomas to this list. Pat Chung is going to follow in Mayo's footsteps and win defensive rookie of the year imo.

Adalius Thomas, if he stays healthy, will be a pro-bowler with double digit sacks and be very effective against the run and in coverage. Remember how good he was playing alongside Lewis and Suggs? Well Mayo and Burgess aren't quite on that level but I'm hearing that Mayo is really going to open some eyes this year. I expect big things from A.D. playing with those two.

I don't think you can leave Warren off the list for the Pats. He's not the pass rusher that Seymour is, but he's a run stopping machine.

last year i remember that you selected the seattle seahawks to make super bowl. who were their blue chips?

Great idea, Mike. The coach/QB dynamic doesn't get enough focus. Closely related is the QB/system fit. Joe Gibbs drafted Jason Campbell. He looked like a perfect fit for Gibbs' old offense, only that old offense couldn't move the ball now. So then the team brought in Al Saunders, with his 700 page playbook. Campbell was lost. Two years later, they bring in Zorn to install the WCO. Campbell is lost again, classic case of round peg in square hole.

I think most of you are really overrating how many blue chippers your teams have. No team has more than 5 blue chippers by the definition laid out above. The last line of top 10 at position makes it seem like there are a lot but players who consistently perform at a level that causes them to create mismatches and have big impacts on the game every single week.

Patriots: Mayo and Welker are not blue chippers. Welker performs as well as he does because of Moss and Brady. He is PERFECT in his role as a #2 who runs the short routes but he takes advantage of the matchups that Moss creates.

Colts: Bob Sanders is not in anyway a blue chipper. He is injured all the time and even when he plays is a great high energy guy but not a blue chipper.

Chargers: McNeil, Cromartie and Tomlinson are not bluechippers. McNeil is good, but not great, he still could develop more but this past season put him into his place. If Cromartie is good when Merriman is healthy, that means Merriman is the blue chipper not Cromartie. After LT's season last year plus the overall decline based on age, I think its safe to say he is no longer a blue chipper. Very rarely do tailbacks rebound this late in their career.

This is what I think based on the definition, hell maybe I'm completely wrong but I see about 50 guys in the NFL being blue chippers. Also being a Steeler fan I'll put down my opinion on my team just so it doesn't seem like I'm only here to criticize.

Steelers:

Ben Roethlisberger - easily top 5 QB, creates mismatches that benefit everyone around him.

James Harrison - Incredible pass rushing ability that forces a TE or RB to help on him. Changes a team's gameplan.

Troy Polamalu - Between him and Reed for best playmaking safety. Great against run and pass. QB knows where he is before every play.


Not Quite There:

Heath Miller - Great TE, but not special.

Hines Ward - Could have been a in his prime, not anymore.

James Farrior – Great LB, great leader, same as Heath Miller nothing special.

Let me know what you think.

@Dan

OK, maybe I'm being a bit hasty in calling Mayo a bluechipper. He did win defensive rookie of the year and I believe that he's going to be a top 10 linebacker in the league this year. He still needs to go out and prove it though so I see your point there.

I have to disagree about Welker though. This guy is a bluechipper all the way imo. His quickness is constantly creating mismatches and his hands (2007: 112 rec., 2008: 111 rec. w/o Brady, only lost 1 fumble in his entire career) and toughness (hasn't missed a game in 4 years) for a guy his size are amazing when you consider the hits he takes from safeties and linebackers week in and week out.

You're a Steelers fan. Remember that hit Ryan Clark had on him last year? The one where Clark left his feet and nearly decapitated him? He was back the very next week. So yeah, he's tough, and he's someone that opposing defenses have to gameplan against.

@ Jack

I love Ty Warren but I can't call him a bluechipper. Is he a top 10 DT in the league? No. Maybe top 25 when healthy. Do opposing teams gameplan against him? No. They do against Seymour and Wilfork but not Ty. Does he create mismatches? Occasionally but not consistently enough as far as I'm concerned. He's solid, don't get me wrong, but I'm trying not to let my Pats bias cloud my vision. He's no bluechipper. He's on the next tier down from that.

i've been sitting here trying to cook up a defense for welker, and what it comes down to is th is: he is a great player, and would do well anywhere, but he would not be a force to be planned around on any team. put moss on any team (except the raiders) and he is dominating (granted he needs a decent qb, but so do all wr). so, with that in mind (and as a pats fan), i'd go with

offense:
brady
moss

defense:
wilfork
seymour

down the road, i think mayo has a good chance to make this list, and very likely ad (if he can stay healthy) will be on this list next august.

also, i'm new here, and i'd just like to say how bizarre it feels to be on a football discussion board where people are writing well thought out and intelligent posts (not to mention coherently responding to one another). it's refreshing not to have the rapid non-sense that seems to ruin all other boards.

Cardinals

Offense:

Kurt Warner
Larry Fitzgerald
Anquan Boldin

Defense:

Adrian Wilson
Dominic Rogers Cromartie
Karlos Dansby
Darnell Dockett

@MIke

On Mayo - I think he is a great player and will certainly be a blue chipper down the line somewhere but I don't think he's there yet so I think we agree on him.

On Welker - I think the difference between a great player and a blue chipper is a blue chipper has that one abnormal amazing ability. For Moss his deep ball ability, Roethlisberger his ability to move around in the pocket for a big guy, for Peterson the way he runs through arm tackles.

With that in mind Welker does have that, he's unbelievably quick even for his size. I think him and Steve Smith are close to the same level. Also extremely tough and competitive. Plus it seems like the Pats success depends on his success, when he does well so do they.

Even with all that in mind, I'm still up in the air on him. He didn't put up great numbers in Miami (but then again it was Miami), and I feel like he took over Deion Branch's position and is putting up better stats just because the rest of the offense got better.

Unfortunately, it's impossible to see Welker on a team without Moss right now and I don't catch every Pats game so this is an area where you will have more insight than me. I will make sure to watch him more closely this upcoming season and for now will put him in my undecided category.

I am looking forward to reading Mike's take on this subject. I will say, however, that I find some of the comments here, suggesting players from fans to be comical--bordering on hilarious. To all of you Browns, Chargers, Packers, Patriots, Packers and Vikings fans who offered suggestions, I have a question. With all of those blue-chippers, how did your team fare in the Super Bowl this year?